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Ticket Pricing Strategy
#1
The ECB needs to do something about pricing to stop clubs from setting their own prices and pricing crowds out of grounds (like today, Eng V Pakistan @ Edgbaston day one, 5,000 empty seats in two thirds of the ground)

So what about the below pricing structure?

Irrespective of the ground or who or what stage of the competition is playing.

County Championship (per day):
Adults: £10

Children: £1

CB40:
Adults: £12

Children: £1

FPT20:
Adults: £15

Children: £1

One Day International:

Adults: £25

Children: £5

Test Match

Adults: £30

Children: £10
Read my Ashes blog at otis-bear.tumblr.com/ashes2010 :thumbup:
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#2
Sensible pricing stratergy, Otis

I have always looked at it from a simple viewpoint:
5,000 x £20 = £100,000
0 x £65 = £0

Unfortunately it seems those who wield the power are blind to this
Bears fan, Wolves fan, blood red Socialist, a not so vital statistician...
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#3
its £90 for the Oval test - so 60 quid's a bargain
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#4
I saw that Sweaty!
I'm a horrid bint.....apparently!
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#5
Good post Otis. We can argue about the structure - but the structure does need looking at. I've been banging on about this for a few seasons now. For me this is the first major match I will not be attending for many years.

The warning signs have been there. Each time a chief exec stands up and gives an excuse. In 2005 I paid £ 30 to £ 35 for an Ashes ticket in 2006 I paid £ 35 for a Sri Lanka Test ticket. Things then went crazy and became too expensive, as the game created a 'bubble'..... and like all bubbles they will eventually burst (from the 1624 Tulip bubble (worth a google) to modern day economic markets). They already have a buy one get one free offer on the Internet for the third day as the administrators panic to off load tickets. The race for the £ 100 test ticket started after 2005 (when my Ashes ticket cost £ 35) and will kill test cricket in this country. £ 120 for me and my wife plus Food, drink, travel, day off work (book the day off and it rains?)...... don’t think so. I still remember watching the England team race between the wickets to get 25 overs in between 5 and 7 pm last year against Australia so my £ 65 tickets weren’t refunded..... or Collingwood leaving the field with 5 balls left in the NZ ODI (£55) after the teams had taken an hour lunch break with poor weather lurking around.

In reality we will end up with crowds of several thousand who think a day at the test is still good value as they look at the empty flapping plastic seats. You could see the gaps appearing in 2008 when a third of the ground was empty for the NZ ODI, there were big gaps for all days of that years SA Test (Warwickshire’s chief exec was in denial) and they had to resort to BOGOF's for the 2009 WI ODI and 2010 Bangladesh ODI where panic set in and tickets were put in a fire sale at £ 15 each.
There is no clear ticket selling policy / strategy (BOGOF’s upset those who buy their tickets early) and I’m afraid there was a tipping point for ticket prices where you start to loose thousands – and for many (not all) £ 60 starts to cross it. The perception is that it is now an expensive day out.

I think Colins statement ("The club is struggling to meet any of its commercial targets at present with membership marginally down...... the neutral T20Is between Pakistan and Australia also below target and ticket sales for the Test against Pakistan sluggish......Ticket sales for the Test are very important to us....... We're a bit below where we'd like to be and, if we don't sell aggressively in the next week or so, there's no way of making up that money.) suggests that at least the problem is now on the agenda rather than being hidden behind marketing speak and other hyperbole for the consumption of a journalist with a microphone. It isn't just visable on the balance sheet - its visable to the naked eye. Its finally been noticed by TV, Radio and the press.

However, this is not just an Edgbaston problem it is a Cricket wide problem. The missing people are starting to appear at many venues. The ECB and counties need to get real and work out the way forward. If not, I really fear for the game I love.
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#6
I was asked in my local last night why I had not gone to the test. When I mentioned £60 a day to watch they understood and thought I would have been mad to have gone.
LE - aka John
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#7
(07-08-2010, 09:41 AM)Warleybear Wrote: Good post Otis. We can argue about the structure - but the structure does need looking at. I've been banging on about this for a few seasons now. For me this is the first major match I will not be attending for many years.

The warning signs have been there. Each time a chief exec stands up and gives an excuse. In 2005 I paid £ 30 to £ 35 for an Ashes ticket in 2006 I paid £ 35 for a Sri Lanka Test ticket. Things then went crazy and became too expensive, as the game created a 'bubble'..... and like all bubbles they will eventually burst (from the 1624 Tulip bubble (worth a google) to modern day economic markets). They already have a buy one get one free offer on the Internet for the third day as the administrators panic to off load tickets. The race for the £ 100 test ticket started after 2005 (when my Ashes ticket cost £ 35) and will kill test cricket in this country. £ 120 for me and my wife plus Food, drink, travel, day off work (book the day off and it rains?)...... don’t think so. I still remember watching the England team race between the wickets to get 25 overs in between 5 and 7 pm last year against Australia so my £ 65 tickets weren’t refunded..... or Collingwood leaving the field with 5 balls left in the NZ ODI (£55) after the teams had taken an hour lunch break with poor weather lurking around.

In reality we will end up with crowds of several thousand who think a day at the test is still good value as they look at the empty flapping plastic seats. You could see the gaps appearing in 2008 when a third of the ground was empty for the NZ ODI, there were big gaps for all days of that years SA Test (Warwickshire’s chief exec was in denial) and they had to resort to BOGOF's for the 2009 WI ODI and 2010 Bangladesh ODI where panic set in and tickets were put in a fire sale at £ 15 each.
There is no clear ticket selling policy / strategy (BOGOF’s upset those who buy their tickets early) and I’m afraid there was a tipping point for ticket prices where you start to loose thousands – and for many (not all) £ 60 starts to cross it. The perception is that it is now an expensive day out.

I think Colins statement ("The club is struggling to meet any of its commercial targets at present with membership marginally down...... the neutral T20Is between Pakistan and Australia also below target and ticket sales for the Test against Pakistan sluggish......Ticket sales for the Test are very important to us....... We're a bit below where we'd like to be and, if we don't sell aggressively in the next week or so, there's no way of making up that money.) suggests that at least the problem is now on the agenda rather than being hidden behind marketing speak and other hyperbole for the consumption of a journalist with a microphone. It isn't just visable on the balance sheet - its visable to the naked eye. Its finally been noticed by TV, Radio and the press.

However, this is not just an Edgbaston problem it is a Cricket wide problem. The missing people are starting to appear at many venues. The ECB and counties need to get real and work out the way forward. If not, I really fear for the game I love.

I agree with many of your points Warley, but it's interesting - I went today with a friend who is a mamber of the England Football Supporter's Club - and the ticket prices are about £50 to see a 1 1/2 hour match at Wembley - so travel costs etc. By comparison cricket is reasonable altho' clearly many people don't think so - especially when you factor in the weather! Unless they do sort out the pricing structure across all the test grounds - and introduce the same reasonable tickets prices everywhere, it is going to remain a problem. I am astonished for example that under the current system, grounds are in competition with each other and have to pay huge sums of money to stage a match. It just doesn't seem right.

I was in the ticket office when a stream of people came in complaining about the announcement to offer reduced tickets for tomorrow - I understand them being upset if they paid full price months ago but I'm not sure what Edgbaston are supposed to do when faced with a sub-standard Pakistan team, the likely loss of a couple of days income etc. Plus there was no excuse for how rude and unpleasant people were towards the staff.

Finally, it's not just the ticket pricing structure that needs sorting out but yet again the morons were at it in the Eric Holles stand - while a cricket match is going on, the usual suspects, i.e. drunk blokes in fancy dress were doing everything but watch the cricket - it is so disrespectful to the players - they should be thrown out straight away. The stewards at Edgbaston really need to get a grip.
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#8
I was in the ticket office when a stream of people came in complaining about the announcement to offer reduced tickets for tomorrow - I understand them being upset if they paid full price months ago but I'm not sure what Edgbaston are supposed to do when faced with a sub-standard Pakistan team, the likely loss of a couple of days income etc. Plus there was no excuse for how rude and unpleasant people were towards the staff.

They spoke about this on TMS and said they hoped the club did the honourable thing? They thought it unfair to charge a price then reduce it by such a margin and not refund.
T20 Fantasy League Champion 2010
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#9
The Eric Hollies is notoriously noisy and seeing as Pakistan couldn't muster up a run an over then no wonder they had to make their own entertainment!!
I don't sit in that stand because of the boisterousness but i wouldn't want it stopped as to me, it's all part of the test match day and Saturday is fancy dress day at all the test matches.
Don't forget the rain delays mean there isn't much else to do other than drink..they weren't hurting anybody and we actually spent the last few overs watching them more than the cricket.
If i wanted to watch cricket with no atmosphere then i would go to Lord's.
Also i don't want to see heavy handed stewarding but as long as people are getting ejected if they over step the mark then fine..and i did see plenty getting escorted out.

As for the ticket prices..i've said before..the ECB have created this bidding war and with them giving the go ahead for all these ground re-developments, things will only get worse.
Too many grounds with test status and not enough tests to go round.
I don't see it as the clubs fault that they have offered reduced prices for tomorrow. They have to shift tickets and that is what they are doing. The same as other clubs have found themselves doing.
I don't expect for one minute that the Oval will be any different when it stages this match. At nearly £90 a ticket and a very poor Pakistan side, it certainly won't be a sell out!!!

Personally i wouldn't rush to get advance tickets for anything anymore other than The Ashes as that is one series that will sell out time and time again.
I'm a horrid bint.....apparently!
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#10
Very true Val. I used to apply tickets as soon as they were available............. not anymore. The ECB are the route cause of this problem.

Remember the third day BOGOF didnt come out on the second day when the game was looking one sided - its been around for a few days. Its a real tradgey that Edgbaston cant get their pricing stratedgy right. You now know that if you sit tight a special offer will come along - especially when the tickets are £ 60. No wounder people were upset.............. thats probably even more fans lost. The ones who went to the ticket office were probably the tip of the iceberg. The 'quite' ones probably went home and festered over it.

Outside the ashes I'm afraid the view of many is £ 30 to £35 a ticket. £ 60 plus will kill test cricket in this country.
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#11
I think that as the club has to try and recover the cost of staging an international, they have to set out with a price structure that does that..hence the £60 price. It would be impossible to under cut themselves right from the start as they would be operating at a loss straight away.
I would be interested to know what percentage the club actually gets from a test match ticket once the ECB is paid, the cost of extra stewarding/police and staff etc... i bet it isn't a lot.

People should vent their anger at the ECB not the club.
You have to stage internationals to survive, the ECB know this and are sat rubbing their hands with glee. Go back to last year and the SWALEC getting the first Ashes test, all because they outbid everyone else. There should be a cap on how high a bid should go and that should be at a reasonable level, then the ECB should choose the club with the best proven facilities.
It will be the bidding war will kill test cricket once all the clubs have finished their redevelopments.

I would happily pay £60 a ticket as long as the opposition was worthy of that price...maybe the ECB should have a system in place that grades the visiting team as to their place in the ICC rankings (a bit like in football where you pay more for a Grade A match)
At the end of the day they are responsible for the outright survival of cricket in this country. The clubs have their hands tied to a certain extent and the ECB have got them all by their googlies!
I'm a horrid bint.....apparently!
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#12
Dont think you can work out the % the club gets from a ticket because it depends on how many tickets you sell. If you sell out (ashes) its a lot but, if you dont - like this game - its not much. The whole system does need looking at because at the moment, all the risk is borne by the clubs and there's too many factors they cant control. For example, the rained off Saturday of the ashes test last year was in many ways a result for the club. Insurance meant they didnt lose on the refunded tickets while the rain meant the match went into a highly profitable 5th day. How on earth can you plan/budget anything on that basis?

While I dont like the ethics of constantly diddling people who pay in advance by reducing prices later, and I do think 60 quid is too high, there are other factors involved here. For example, when we took on the test a year ago , who knew Pakistan were going to be so hopeless which puts off their fans as well as ours? Back to back tests in Notts and Brum isnt such a good idea either while the whole relentless programme of international cricket this year is less than attractive after a while. Dont forget Headingley only charged 30 quid - and they still had poor attendances and lost 750,000 on their game.

The club do have to watch it though; because they are fast establishing - or may have already established - the principle that only a loony pays in advance for anything at Warwickshire (ashes tests accepted). This could have big cash flow implications down the line.
Supporter of the 2014 County Champions
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#13
(08-08-2010, 08:39 AM)Kim Wrote: The club do have to watch it though; because they are fast establishing - or may have already established - the principle that only a loony pays in advance for anything at Warwickshire (ashes tests accepted). This could have big cash flow implications down the line.

I do blame the ECB for this. But on Warwickshire side, that is my big concern Kim. It will effect all advance sales. Whilst I have renewed my membership already (as I had the money from a gas refund - I know people who are even planing to play the waiting game over that..... they see the BOGOF's and they remember the half price memberships).

Is £ 60 is good value or not ? Its all about perception......... and for the NZ, WI and Banga ODI's there have been poor ticket sales that lead to empty seats or BOGOF's. The SA test wasnt great either. The lesson for me for some time now(outside the ashes) has been wait and see. I felt diddled by the first day of the Ashes test where my three tickets cost nearly £ 200 to watch 2 hours cricket (the 10 over and 25 over rule doesnt work when tickets start to march to £ 100). The BOGOF's just compounded it......... so I just sit and wait.

What of those upset people yesterday? I suspect there were far more than appeared at the office - and the offer was announced days in adavnce on the internet and on the tanhoy whilst England were still batting - not as some end of day give away due to the state of the game. People will see the club as responsible for this - not the ECB. I fear some of them will not return. Many will wait for the 'offer' next time.

All I ask is that the ECB and the club look long and hard over this. I used to buy tickets 6 to 10 months in advance........... now I wait. After yesterday, I suspect thats what will happen with more and more people.

To some this may seem like a moan - but its become high profile now. I dont want a new ground with 7000 people in it - all saying "great value"; whilst 18,000 people sit at home no longer bothered by a day at the test.

ECB and counties - please review urgently!
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#14
A worry would be that the business plan for repaying the 30 million loan is based on the current high end ticket price strategy.
Supporter of the 2014 County Champions
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#15
Yes that is the problem. What happens if we cant meet the first repayment?
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#16
Colin Povey was interviewd at length yesterday on TMS

http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00...7_08_2010/

fast forward to 4 hours 21 mins and listen for about 30 minutes.
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#17
"As expected guarantees for matches go up, then inevitably ticket prices will have to rise"

"Weve traditionally at Edgbaston priced ourselves somewhere between the London prices and the prices at Trent Bridge, Old Trafford and Headingley"

"We feel that is a symptom of our geographic market and the facilities we are able to offer at the ground"

"Its quite a complicated process"


YOU DONT SAY!!!

It is the complexity (Headline Price vs Special Offers if you wait long enough or fathom the system) they have added to the ticket buying process that will put people off actually buying a ticket in the first place.

Fans may well be 'creatures of habit' (to borrow CP's favourite current turn of phrase) but they ain't stoopid!
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#18
(08-08-2010, 08:39 AM)Kim Wrote: The club do have to watch it though; because they are fast establishing - or may have already established - the principle that only a loony pays in advance for anything at Warwickshire (ashes tests accepted). This could have big cash flow implications down the line.

so i must be a loony then Kim, as i always tend to get my tickets in advance i dont see a problem in that, well i dont class my self as a loony for getting seats where i want to sit, but yes i do agree that there should be more of a structure to ticket prices, but as val say's in a previous post its not the club that are at fault here its the higher archy that is at fault here.
Keep Calm i am a Warwickshire Bear
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#19
Yes and again...it isn't just Warwickshire, it's happening to all the clubs hosting internationals!!
I'm a horrid bint.....apparently!
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#20
(08-08-2010, 03:47 PM)littlepete Wrote:
(08-08-2010, 08:39 AM)Kim Wrote: The club do have to watch it though; because they are fast establishing - or may have already established - the principle that only a loony pays in advance for anything at Warwickshire (ashes tests accepted). This could have big cash flow implications down the line.

so i must be a loony then Kim, as i always tend to get my tickets in advance i dont see a problem in that, well i dont class my self as a loony for getting seats where i want to sit, but yes i do agree that there should be more of a structure to ticket prices, but as val say's in a previous post its not the club that are at fault here its the higher archy that is at fault here.

It is the club. They do the bids and they set the prices so they cant wash their hands of it.

But its also the ECB and their daft bidding process.

And its the other test grounds as well.

They are all in it together. Between them they have set up a roller coaster that none of them can get off. 9 test grounds and a one day ground - all needing international cricket to get by - wont go away.
Supporter of the 2014 County Champions
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